Comments on Advance Indiana™: CCC Pay Raise Outrage: 75%!

Mary Moriarty Adams does not indeed work for the s...

2006-12-23T10:27:00.000-05:00

Mary Moriarty Adams does not indeed work for the state anymore, even though her bio is now incorrect. Governor Daniels, in a move of purely politcal nature, saw to it that she lost her job with the state (that she did very well). I have known Mary my whole life and helped her campaign door-to-door, and she is really one of the most dedicated and in-touch public servants you will ever see, in Indianapolis or anywhere else, Democrat or Republican. (I have to remain anonymous, unfortunately, although I wish I did not because I would love to spread the word about Mary and the job she does).

What's the matter, Ernie, can't stand logic?

2006-12-19T13:30:00.000-05:00

What's the matter, Ernie, can't stand logic?

"The police union rejected the city's last contrac...

2006-12-19T11:40:00.000-05:00

"The police union rejected the city's last contract offer. By only a dozen votes or so, but that's their choice. They expected the city to put that same offer back on the table?"

And,

"I'm glad they're on the streets wearing blue, or black, or whatever the hell color their new uniforms will be. And not negotiating for anything that involves me."

What a PUTZ!

IPD LEO's All of Indianapolis is behind you...except this jerk.

However, citizen legislators should be paid for th...

2006-12-19T11:38:00.000-05:00

However, citizen legislators should be paid for the work they do

I agree there should be something for them, but not more for a "part time" gig than what some people make working full time. 20K per year works out to about $9.60 per hour FT 40hrs/week. Some people work full time and don't make that much.

Holy crap I almost sound like a 'Rat!! But I digress

Anyway, I still hold the viewpoint that being on the CCC should be more about service to your community than pocketing a fat paycheck. And there is time away from the family when attending meetings, answering emails, and I'm sure some councillors end up taking phone calls at home or their business from constituents. However one should NOT construe being on the CCC as the next "get rich quick" plan. You can say "But it's only a little more than $8K per councillor for 29 councillors" .. That works out to an increase of just shy of $250K per year. It's the principle of the thing - especially when the Mayor has essentially told the LEO's to go f**k off.

Also, I doubt there is any shortage of folks wanting to be elected to the CCC. Its a matter of selecting the brightest minds and those with the RIGHT ideas.

I'm Sir Hailstone, and I approve this message.

I'm all for paying these folks well, or fairly. Bu...

2006-12-19T11:21:00.000-05:00

I'm all for paying these folks well, or fairly. But this is bad timing for Democrats, who are going to have to fight like hell to hold onto the council next year. Stupid politics. They're returning to their 60s-70s and early 80s roots: circular firing squads.

And as for the effective date: I read the proposal online Sunday. It was 1-1-07. Mr. Clifford stated as much yesterday. If it's been amended, so be it.

But the original idea was to start in 07. If they think that moving the date alone will mollify the public, it shows how out of touch they are.

Also, comparing this to anything going on with the police contract is a little silly.

The police union rejected the city's last contract offer. By only a dozen votes or so, but that's their choice. They expected the city to put that same offer back on the table?

Huh? When have you ever been involved in negotiaitons that produced a negative vote, then saw the rejecting party "assume" that management's rejected offer is still on the table?

Damned silly logic.

I'm glad they're on the streets wearing blue, or black, or whatever the hell color their new uniforms will be. And not negotiating for anything that involves me.

Bowes is smart enough to know when to recuse himse...

2006-12-19T11:04:00.000-05:00

Bowes is smart enough to know when to recuse himself unlike some others. He will not be on the council when this comes before them again.

Sir Hailstone---point well taken regarding part vs full time but Columbus OH is part-time. However, citizen legislators should be paid for the work they do

because they're not black, cannot be president. By...

2006-12-19T10:59:00.000-05:00

because they're not black, cannot be president. By some arcane reasoning.

I'm not thoroughly convinced that Monroe Gray is black.

Democrats must maintain the council majority in 2007.

3 Presidents in 3 years and Monroe Gray is showing questionable leadership ability? Not to mention the air of corruption that surrounds him. No. The 'Rats had their experiment. They have no business being in the majority on the CCC. It's time to give it back to the GOP and undo the damage the Democrat led CCC has unleashed upon the city.

From Adams' bio on the city-county council website...

2006-12-19T10:57:00.000-05:00

From Adams' bio on the city-county council website: "She works for the Indiana Housing Finance Authority and presently serves as the chair for the Public Safety and Criminal Justice Committee and a member of the Public Works and Economic Development Committees." If she's no longer a state employee, the bio she furnished the city is out-of-date.

Compare the proposed council raise to other compar...

2006-12-19T10:49:00.000-05:00

Compare the proposed council raise to other comparable cities such as Columbus OH.

That depends upon whether the Councillors are considered "full time" or "citizen legislators". For the most part in Indiana the legislators whether its a local board, city council, or the State House - are all "citizen legislators". As Gary wrote on this site before states such as Illinois have full time legislators, and some cities - I'm 97.65% sure Chicago is one - have full time career Aldermen.
All of Indianapolis' Councillors are either retired or have full time jobs, well one, Ginny Cain, last I read is a S.A.H.M. - though any parent will tell you that is a full time job in itself.

I just looked at 612 and 644 again for doublepluscertain - 612 (county officials) would have taken effect 1/1/07. So Greg Bowes would have voted on his own pay raise. 644 affects the councillors and it indeed does have an effective date of 1/1/08.

CORRECTIONS:1. Adams is not a state employee. She ...

2006-12-19T10:07:00.000-05:00

CORRECTIONS:

1. Adams is not a state employee. She works for the nonprofit, National MS Society.

2. This proposal does not take effect until 1-1-2008 which is after next year's council elections so they would not be approving themselves a raise. It would be for whoever is elected next year. Someone is confusing the county elected officials raises that is proposed to be effective 1-1-07 with the newly introduced council raise proposal...two different proposals.

3. Compare the proposed council raise to other comparable cities such as Columbus OH. Then you will see that even with this "raise" Indianapolis is still ridiculously low.

4. Councilors working in the public sector are getting paid for the service/job they do so it's not fair to attack them on that issue. BUT it does create too much of a conflict of interest (although not necessarily as under law) for those in public safety positions...think nutty Sherron Franklin, and Conley's wife who does a terrible job by the way...think Haverstick/Driftwood.

Vote the hard working councilors in and ditch the lazy ones. Simple!

Uh, Wilson, the council elections are NEXT year. ...

2006-12-19T08:53:00.000-05:00

Uh, Wilson, the council elections are NEXT year. You're a committeeman. You should know that.

The proposal, as drafted, takes effect 1-1-07. Mr. Clifford said so--his budget calculated the increase but forgot to specifically call out the council members, which must be done by ordinance/proposal. It could be amended. It should be killed.

This has a ripple effect. The IPS Board, and perhaps some others, tie their salaries by policy, to the CCC salaries.

I am full well aware Rozelle is a doctor. He is a friend and I have earned the right to call him by his first name.

Good enough friends for me to tell him he was a lousy council president, precisely because he's such a nice guy. Wordy, but a nice guy.

He's usually right on issues. He is the councillor who called down the ridiculous Driftwood Hills/Whole Foods MDC hearing officer decision. You know, the one where Mrs. Conley ignored statute, invented evidence and had her husband carry the water for her in the council caucus?

And BTW, Wilson, are you the chief apologist for all things Democratic? Even if they're stupid? This insane proposal just dragged down the entire party for the next election cycle. The mayor is dragged into it, too, and he has nothing to do with council salaries.

As a Democrat, I'm embarrassed by the lack of leadership demonstrated on that council. The best potential leaders are females, and, because they're not black, cannot be president. By some arcane reasoning.

The same reasoning that led to this council proposal ever seeing the light of day. Which it shouldn't have.

Democrats must maintain the council majority in 2007. This makes it harder. It's that simple.

The councilors would not necessarily be voting the...

2006-12-19T08:45:00.000-05:00

The councilors would not necessarily be voting themselves a pay raise.

True. However many are just arrogant enough [*cough* Ron Gibson *cough*]to believe they will still be on the CCC on January 1, 2008. Heh.

We'll see about that.

It should be mentioned again that this proposal wo...

2006-12-19T07:37:00.000-05:00

It should be mentioned again that this proposal would not take effect until after the council elections this year. The councilors would not necessarily be voting themselves a pay raise.

btw, it's Dr. Rozelle Boyd, a retired Dean and professor from IU-Bloomington.

For some of these folks, it's hte most money they'...

2006-12-19T06:59:00.000-05:00

For some of these folks, it's hte most money they've ever made. Seriously.

The original idea for this came from King Ro Conley. He then took his name off the proposal, allegedly, and put Rozelle's on it, because the rumor is, Rozelle isn't going to run again.

Rozelle is retired from IU--another public paycheck.

I have nothing against civil servants. Good ones are worth their weight ing old.

But this preponderance of public employees on the council is disgusting.

Anon is rigiht: Mr. President's real "job" gets him an unmarked IFD car, too. Good gig.

Isn't the issue the lack of citizens willing to do...

2006-12-19T05:41:00.000-05:00

Isn't the issue the lack of citizens willing to do such a job for little or nothing? The notion of "citiznes legislators" has become almost quaint.

Its beyond pathetic that this paltry amount of money is enticing to some who wish to perform service for the public good.

Calling Monroe Gray a firefighter uses the term ve...

2006-12-19T00:22:00.000-05:00

Calling Monroe Gray a firefighter uses the term very loosely. While he draws a paycheck from IFD, just what he does there is questionable.

Before the other side says anything:Lincoln Plowma...

2006-12-18T23:40:00.000-05:00

Before the other side says anything:

Lincoln Plowman - MCSD deputy

Issac Randolph - IFD firefighter

They ought to tax the pea shake houses (illegal ga...

2006-12-18T22:59:00.000-05:00

They ought to tax the pea shake houses (illegal gambling frequented by council pres & ghost fire employee Monroe Gray) to pay for it, too!