Comments on Advance Indiana™: Have American Jews Awakened To The Real Barack Obama?

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2013-02-28T01:30:52.200-05:00

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Teller Visit Recorder

I know what I believe the term means, Paul, as I&#...

2010-06-22T06:30:04.725-05:00

I know what I believe the term means, Paul, as I've discussed with you many times. You can't simply give birth to a kid on U.S. soil regardless of the parents' citizenship status and call him or her an NBC in my opinion. We didn't get an interpretation of the 2nd Amendment from our Supreme Court until a couple of years ago and that was a 5-4 decision. The NBC issue has never been decided by the Supreme Court.

I know you don't like the natural born citizen...

2010-06-22T00:34:26.644-05:00

I know you don't like the natural born citizenship requirement, but don't pretend it means something that it does not.

Well put. You're rationale is yours. The founders' was theirs, as Teller points out. Who's the original constructionist here??

That'a state court decision that has been high...

2010-06-21T06:10:23.256-05:00

That'a state court decision that has been highly criticized, TellerIP. The Indiana Court of Appeals did not have that issue before it because the suit had been dismissed on jurisdictional grounds. The judge who wrote the opinion went ahead and gave her personal opinion on the meaning of a federal constitutional provision, as well as facts that had never been established, including where a president back in the 1800s had been born. The decision is a joke and is not authoritative for any future federal court decision.

You said: "I've maintained that is doesn&...

2010-06-21T00:04:55.627-05:00

You said: "I've maintained that is doesn't matter whether he was born in Hawaii."

Answer. You are wrong. He was born in Hawaii, and it matters because the fact that he was born in the USA is the reason that he is a Natural Born Citizen.

You said: "His father's Kenyan citizenship makes him ineligible to be president of the U.S.

Answer. You are wrong. EVERY US citizen who was born in the USA is a Natural Born Citizen. That is the original meaning of Natural Born, which comes from the common law and not from Vattel, and at the time of the writing of the Constitution meant "born in the country with the exception of the children of foreign diplomats." That is the way that Adams and Hamilton use the phrase "Natural Born," and they never use it to mean that a person requires two citizen parents to be Natural Born.

You said: "Despite all of the lawsuits filed against his eligiblity, none of those suits were decided on the merits of that constitutional argument.

You are wrong. This one did:

http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/11120903.ebb.pdf

This ruling by the Indiana court of appeals says clearly that Obama is a Natural Born Citizen and that the citizenship of his father is not relevant. The case was appealed to the Supreme Court of Indiana, which did not accept the appeal, meaning that the ruling stands.

In any case, the reason that the US Congress confirmed Obama's election UNANIMOUSLY is that not one member of the 100 Senators and 435 members of the House believed your definition of Natural Born Citizen. All 535 believe that birth in the USA is sufficient to make a Natural Born Citizen.

Some examples:

Senator Lindsey Graham (R-SC), said:

“Every child born in the United States is a natural-born United States citizen except for the children of diplomats.” (December 11, 2008 letter to constituent)

Senator Orrin G. Hatch (R-UT), said:

“What is a natural born citizen? Clearly, someone born within the United States or one of its territories is a natural born citizen.” (Senate Judiciary Committee hearing hearing on OCTOBER 5, 2004)

Glad to hear, however, that you do not believe the loony idea that Obama was born in Kenya. Or the equally crazy one that he lost his US citizenship during his stay in Indonesia.

I've maintained that is doesn't matter whe...

2010-06-20T20:55:50.297-05:00

I've maintained that is doesn't matter whether he was born in Hawaii. His father's Kenyan citizenship makes him ineligible to be president of the U.S. Despite all of the lawsuits filed against his eligiblity, none of those suits were decided on the merits of that constitutional argument and for good reason. And I'm not buying anything the Indonesian embassy claims. That government has every incentive to cover up the true facts and blackmail Obama. Further, the Russians and the U.K. know the truth about his foreign citizenship, and maybe the Israeli Mossad. Putin laughs in Obama's face much the same way Kruschev did to Kennedy.

Re: "There is plenty of evidence that Barry&#...

2010-06-20T19:50:52.066-05:00

Re: "There is plenty of evidence that Barry's parents were willing to lie."

I am glad that you accept that Obama's parents lied on the application that said that Obama was an Indonesian citizen. The evidence that they lied is the Indonesian Embassy saying that he was never a citizen of Indonesia.

Also: I notice that you have given up on the absurd notion that he was not born in Hawaii.

My superficial observations: 1)Israel and Palesti...

2010-06-19T19:46:07.034-05:00

My superficial observations:

1)Israel and Palestine have been countries, settlements, locales of varying historical occupation, roughly East of the Med, South of Syria, and West of the River Jordan & Lake Galilee for thousands of years. I suggest there be two countries be carved-out and they get along or fight to the death. One party lacking a country in that area given the preponderance of history is not a solution. No religious mandate for either- but look at the collective history that justifys the geographical existence of each.

2)I'm not a "birther", but am a "recorder". I see zero reason for ANY President that can send our children to war to not share all his birth, educational, political and health records. Period.

And more accurately, the Israel Lobby does not onl...

2010-06-19T17:45:47.069-05:00

And more accurately, the Israel Lobby does not only include AIPAC, but also CAMERA, ADL, WINEP, and many others. For more info on the topic of "Obama and the Israel Lobby", check Anthony DiMaggio's study of the topic, in a series of reports, which can be read on line. Have a great weekend.

For sure, HFFT. Most probably the main reason tha...

2010-06-19T17:25:08.482-05:00

For sure, HFFT. Most probably the main reason that Congress has been amenable to the lynching IS because most of them receive large donations from AIPAC, a/k/a the Israel Lobby. The four main Indiana recipients are: Bayh, Hill, Burton, and Pence, the rascals extraordinaire. Don't get me started.****

The lynch mob I saw was the one on the flotilla by...

2010-06-19T15:45:33.532-05:00

The lynch mob I saw was the one on the flotilla by the Israeli military. They aren't innocent in this.

Thanks for sharing that Marycatherine, The Globe&#...

2010-06-19T07:29:38.714-05:00

Thanks for sharing that Marycatherine, The Globe's teaser to the story: "President Barack Obama secretly holds a life-time membership in Chicago's most notorious gay bath house! That's the shocking charge by a prominent political insider, who rips the lid off the sensational scandal in an exclusive GLOBE interview that's must reading for every American." There have been stories that he often used a foreign passport under a different name before his rise to fame. I'm wondering if he didn't use it when he visited Steamworks in Chicago for anonymous gay sex.

TellerIP, There is plenty of evidence that Barry&#...

2010-06-19T07:24:17.197-05:00

TellerIP, There is plenty of evidence that Barry's parents were willing to lie. You wrote, "Sure, his parents CLAIMED that he was an Indonesian citizen in an application to a school. Does that mean that he really was an Indonesian citizen? Answer with another question: Do parents ever lie to get their children into the right schools?" Also, Obama claims in his book that he remembered his mother getting welfare benefits while living in Hawaii. Yet, she somehow managed to send him to the most expensive, elite private school in Hawaii. He also wrote in his book that his mother had a tendency to tell him things that were untrue. I suspect one of the things she lied to him about was his birth. In anger, maybe he destroyed that original birth certificate. He held a lot of anger towards her. Near her end while she lay dying in a hospital of cervical cancer, he refused to visit her. That's also about the time he released his book with a title that praised a father who never had any part of his life while showing little respect for her, the person who made sure he had the best education opportunities whereever he lived. Her friends were very upset about the book but not her. She understood that's just the way Barry was. She did choose to marry two Muslim men despite the religion's long history of treating women as second class citizens.

"Jews reveal their plans for the world" ...

2010-06-19T01:43:53.325-05:00

"Jews reveal their plans for the world" is the title of the video, which you can find on-line, youtube, of course, which contains this quote of Lewis, at the end of it. Words from their own mouths or pens.

Thank you for sharing some of your philosophical a...

2010-06-19T01:35:54.826-05:00

Thank you for sharing some of your philosophical and religious perspectives, here by comment, Gary. Would you be comfortable with then being labeled a Zionist Christian? I am not, and wish we followed George Washington's advice, and did not become so intertwined with a foreign country.

Re Cato's comment, I just read today that Ann Lewis, Barney Frank's sister who was Hillary Clinton's aide, once upon a time, is quoted as saying, that the president of the USA is supposed to do what Israel tells him to. No wonder so many people say that the capital of the USA is in Tel Aviv.

Again, thank you AI, for leading a discussion on this. Scared, am I!!

FYI: Check out the 6/28/10 GLOBE, now on the news...

2010-06-19T01:16:50.783-05:00

FYI: Check out the 6/28/10 GLOBE, now on the newstand this week, "Obama's Gay Bathhouse Scandal! Secret He's Hiding From America". Yes, the Globe has broken this story, and cites the Wayne Madsen Report, to which I subscribe, throughout.

Re Israel and our zionist-controlled government wanting to board iran's boats, since UN has issued sanctions, the much-respected John Coleman, PhD, can be heard with his take, on Friday's the Alex Jones Show. He agrees with me that this will lead to, at the very least, a conflagration in the Middle-East, which will eventually lead to the destruction of the USA, and the dismantling of the free market system, and private property, making all of us subject to the social engineering plans of our ruling class. If you want to know some of their names, they are listed in THE NEW JERUSALEM, by Michael Collin Piper, an investigative reporter, whose works the haters of free speech will not allow in the Marion County Public Library, but can be found on line.

You commented: “You ignore the point, TellerIP, th...

2010-06-19T01:14:11.145-05:00

You commented: “You ignore the point, TellerIP, that parents could claim a child was born in Hawaii that wasn't actually born there and get a birth certificate from the state, even though no doctor attested to the child's birth. “

Ask yourself whether in ANY state if there was no doctor or other witness present the law forbids the parents from stating that the child was born in the state and the state must accept their statement. I am informed that this is normal and that every state has such a provision, just in case the only ones present at the birth are the parents, or for that matter only the mother. This is allowed because it has to be allowed.

It is POSSIBLE for two witnesses (the parents) to lie anywhere, and as a result some birth certificates may be inaccurate. (For that matter witnesses lie in other things too).

But (1) though it is possible in any state for witnesses to lie, it does not prove that Obama’s parents DID lie. There is no proof that they did lie.

You do not take up my point, which was that the birth certificate being based on a claim by the parents applies ONLY where there was no doctor. Yet we know from the governor of Hawaii, and the witness, and the Obama’s that Obama was born in a hospital, Kapiolani, and hence there WAS a doctor present.

And, as I also said, although it was possible for the parents to lie, it would be highly risky for them to have done so. If the child really had been born in Kenya, because they would be lying about something that other passengers on the airline or boat coming back from Kenya would have known not to be true. Moreover, we have the statement of Obama’s Kenyan grandmother and the witness that Obama was born in Hawaii, and Obama’s own comment (made in 1995 when Obama could hardly imagine the chance of running for president ) that his mother did not have a passport in 1961.

Re Washington: This neither proves nor disproves birth in the USA.

Re Montreal. I am a Natural Born US Citizen, but even if I were Canadian, or you were Canadian, it would not change the facts.

The United States does not exist to benefit Israel...

2010-06-19T00:05:54.801-05:00

The United States does not exist to benefit Israel. Israel is not our client state. Our blind allegiance to Israel, and our meddling in Middle East affairs, is costing us dearly and may create massive future liabilities.

For the last 1700 years, few Jews have lived in the Levant. This recent experiment of giving them a country out of the homeland of others has never gone smoothly, and we should distance ourselves from it.

For you other readers, the log in information for ...

2010-06-18T23:30:43.868-05:00

For you other readers, the log in information for TellerIP registers him at an IP address in Montreal. I'm not surprised. Some of the most prolific defenders of Obama on this blog in the past have been registered at IP addresses outside this country.

You ignore the point, TellerIP, that parents could...

2010-06-18T23:22:56.056-05:00

You ignore the point, TellerIP, that parents could claim a child was born in Hawaii that wasn't actually born there and get a birth certificate from the state, even though no doctor attested to the child's birth. We know that his mother was in the state of Washington with him shortly after his birth. A friend had to teach her how to change his diaper. Regardless of his place of birth, Obama was never eligible to run for president because he's not a natural born citizen. His natural father's Kenyan citizenship made it impossible for him to attain this status, one which is only constitutionally required of persons seeking to become president of the United States. I've read John Jay's reasoning behind this provision and know what it means. It is only in contemporary American history that this constitutional provision has been interpreted to mean you only had to be born on American soil. This would allow a Mexican woman to cross the border illegally, give birth to a child in the U.S. who could later grow up to be president. That is clearly contrary to the intent of this provision. I know you don't like the natural born citizenship requirement, but don't pretend it means something that it does not.

Marycatherine, I was taught that Jesus was my lord...

2010-06-18T23:04:16.935-05:00

Marycatherine, I was taught that Jesus was my lord savior as a Christian. I'm told he was never married, but I think Mary Magdaline was probably as close as you come to a wife and may have given birth to a child of his. Jesus was also a Jew. He spread a message of love and peace during his short life. Muhammad, on the other hand, like Obama, was a bastard child. He had 13 wives, including a 6-year old wife who he procreated with when she was only 9. He spent a great deal of his life fighting and conquering other non-Muslims in the Arabic world. I know people of the Islamic faith carry out dastardly deeds against Christians and Jews every day because of who we are in the name of Allah and Muhammad. I've not seen a similar quest among people of my faith or among Judaism in my lifetime. Biblical prophecy foretold the return of Jews to Israel. I'm not much of a religous scholar, but I'm pretty certain which side I want to be on come judgment day.

You said: "It is not unusual for Asians livin...

2010-06-18T22:55:10.913-05:00

You said: "It is not unusual for Asians living in Hawaii to give birth to their children abroad and then later obtain a birth certificate from the state of Hawaii. That doesn't prove that the child was born in Hawaii; it simply means the parents took the time to register the child's birth."

That is right. Asians often feel better having US documents, and they can, now (they couldn't in 1961), get a Hawaii birth certificate even if the child was not born in Hawaii. BUT the Hawaii document would not say "born in Hawaii" on it. Obama's does.

Re: "It's quite entertaining watching Oba...

2010-06-18T22:45:37.372-05:00

Re: "It's quite entertaining watching Obama pretend to be tough on BP when he took more money from the international conglomerate than any other American politician and was relaxing rules on their offshore drilling operations when its rig blew up in the Gulf. "

Don't confuse your dislike for the man with the issue of where he was born. US-born politicians are capable of doing exactly the same thing.

It is perfectly fine to discuss such issues, and on them I may agree with you in some cases. But these issues do not affect Obama's place of birth or his alleged Indonesian citizenship.

Some birthers I suppose, feel that it is perfectly fine to continue to post untruths about Obama's place of birth or Indonesian citizenship because they hate him so much. But it is immoral. Once they recognize that Obama could not have been born in Kenya, they should stop.

Re: "a paid blog commenter for the Obama prop...

2010-06-18T22:38:08.997-05:00

Re: "a paid blog commenter for the Obama propaganda machine."

I assume you are not getting paid. Well, neither am I.

The facts would be the same regardless of whether you were paid or I were paid or both of us were paid. And the facts are that Obama has overwhelming proof that he was born in Hawaii in the official document, confirmed by the two heads of the departments of health and vital records and the governor, and the witness who recalls being told of the birth and writing home about it, and the Kenyan grandmother who repeatedly said that Obama was born in Hawaii and Obama saying in 1995 (long before the place of his birth mattered) that his mother did not have a passport in 1961. (He said that she and he applied for their passports in 1966 when they were getting ready to go to Indonesia.)

Lastly before zionism became the ruling philosophy...

2010-06-18T21:26:17.446-05:00

Lastly before zionism became the ruling philosophy, in the country formerly called Palestine, Muslims, Christians, and Jews were living and working together, in peace. Still today 30% of the beleagured
Gazans are Christians, in dire need with their fellow Gazans, of assistance from the internation community, because they sure as hell are not getting it from zionist Israelis.

I look forward to the day, when there is just one state, no longer called Israel, but the Republic of Palestine, where people are not forced to carry identification tags, with one saying Jews, and the other, Arabs, which is the requirement now of the Jewish government of Israel, so-called. Now, many of the Jews there, with impunity, spit on the Catholic priests and other religious.