Comments on Advance Indiana™: Carmel Junior High School Turns Paris Hilton

Come on, AI, there's a couple of famous male slut ...

2007-05-17T10:11:00.000-05:00

Come on, AI, there's a couple of famous male slut celebrities you could point the finger at too. No need just to name the women.

"Of course there are some kids who are being influ...

2007-05-16T12:31:00.000-05:00

"Of course there are some kids who are being influenced by pop-culture trash, but I don't think it's cause for such hysterics. My guess is if you examined the family lives of the kids in this Carmel story you would find where the problem lies, and I doubt seriously it's Britney Spears or Paris Hilton."

I agree to a point. However, it seems that parents are sometimes so strapped, that even good parents fail their kids. I really want to know: Where these kids from homes where the income was $100K+, $250K+, etc.. Were these kids of rich white trash, or kids of rich elite lawyers and doctors. Were these kids from single parent homes, living in the cheapest Carmel apartments.

It is very easy to think "These are just the kids of trash, even rich trash. Trash have these kinds of morals, so it is to be expected." The problem is that today, kids meet more people, get around more. When good parents are working too much, etc. and forget their kids, a situation like Rockdale Co., GA happens.

Look at this graphic:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/georgia/art/matrix.gif

As you can see, it only takes about eight kids to really affect many others. A lot of people think that all the teens of Rockdale Co. were sleeping with many people. The chart shows that really wasn't the case. A lot of those kids only had sex with one or two partners. I can pretty much guess what happens: Some kid just wants to have sex and does, then decides it wasn't right or then looks for a monogamous relationship. Others might have been kids who thought they were in love and gave it up, only to find out the person they slept with wasn't into relationships.

Also in this case, a few of the girls went ghetto diving, sleeping with trashy kids from the really poor areas of Atlanta. It was here where they caught syphilis and then passed it onto suburban teenagers. If this had been HIV, how many deaths would be looking at? Protection was not being used because they said the abortion rate was higher, much higher, than the average rate for similar areas.

Very scary stuff.

"In a lot of ways, it's just the free market at wo...

2007-05-16T12:17:00.000-05:00

"In a lot of ways, it's just the free market at work."

Is that supposed to be a joke? There is not such thing as a "free" market when the government controls the market. Say a decent, multi-millionaire was sick of the garbage put out by our radio stations. That person decides that he could make enough money to cover costs and out play the trash music, so he opens his own radio station on the same freq. as 96.3. Guess what happens, he gets arrested by government agents because he doesn't have an FCC permission slip to use that freq.

This is the problem with media and radio. There is no "free" market, only a controlled market. If you have money, start a radio station with a stronger signal on the freq. of your choice. You will quickly be arrested and fined. Such much for that "free" market.

Steph said, "This was going on when I was in seven...

2007-05-16T11:28:00.000-05:00

Steph said, "This was going on when I was in seventh grade back in the 80's." The only thing I remember along that order from my 7th grade back in the mid-70s was when a first-year teacher invited the cheerleaders and a few basketball players over to her house, got them drunk and then asked the boys to take turns having sex with her. It was all over town the same night, and she never stepped foot in the classroom the next day. She was immediately fired.

Yes this his hugely disturbing - but the only thin...

2007-05-16T10:39:00.000-05:00

Yes this his hugely disturbing - but the only thing new here is that it's being captured on cell phone and distributed. This was going on when I was in seventh grade back in the 80's - not everyone was doing it, but I heard enough about it to know that kids were having sex in 7th grade.

I'm not suggesting in any way that it's good, or acceptable, or that something doesn't need to change. I'm only pointing out that it isn't at all new.

and this line - "It seems that Bill Clinton and Monica Lewinsky ushered in a whole new era in America where trash rules."

Neither of these two chose to make their sexual relationship public - that was Ken Starr. So if you want to blame someone for making sleaze acceptable, put the blame on him where it belongs.

It ain't just Carmel!http://www.indystar.com/apps/...

2007-05-16T08:03:00.000-05:00

It ain't just Carmel!
http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070516/LOCAL/70516030
Police alerted when youth is ‘pantsed’ at dance

I have to play devil's advocate here. How many of ...

2007-05-16T07:55:00.000-05:00

I have to play devil's advocate here. How many of the Bush family have been arrested over the past decades for all sorts of "trashy" acts? Our current prez used to be a first-class drunk, and his daughters have not been angels. How about Jeb's kids? There's plenty of trash to go around and every party has its share.

Oh! you liberal idiots. we all have been doing cra...

2007-05-16T01:10:00.000-05:00

Oh! you liberal idiots. we all have been doing crap like this this since the 1950's.
back then there wasn't the internet or cell phones with camera's so the media didnt pick up on it.

Was there ANY parental judgment in evidence...1) W...

2007-05-16T00:08:00.000-05:00

Was there ANY parental judgment in evidence...

1) When the 14-year-old little darlings got phones capable of making and sharing videos and photos, with all costs billed to the parent's account?

2) When they left their 14-year-old little darlings coupled(?) together in an unsupervised situation long enough for said acts to occur?

3) When said 14-year-old little darlings so-called 'best friends forever' decided that video-recording their BFF's engaged in said sex acts would be 'so cool' (to use 60's lingo).

4) When said 14-year-old little darlings cast said recordings upon the Internet, again without adult supervision.

Where WERE the parents?

Well, the parents were probably both at work, because two jobs are required to maintain the Carmel simulation of a lifestyle, and besides, trying to pay for the Lexi, taxes on the McMansion (thanks again, Jim Brainard), the interest-only mortgage (but just until the housing market heats up again and the credit cards are paid down a little), the student loans for the older children's Ivy League educations, the vacation trips abroad, weekend get-a-ways to Vegas, alimony from the last three ex's (his 2 and her 1), and a home well-stocked with adult beverages and wonder-drugs to relieve the overwhelming stress of maintaining this charade for the neighbors.

Good Lord, how COULD ANYONE in Carmel have time to actually PARENT a teenager?

I have to schedule my 13-year-old's OB-GYN appointments MONTHS in advance just to get her contraceptives so she doesn't get pregnant like her older sisters did!

Bill didn't have vaginal intercourse with Monica. ...

2007-05-15T20:49:00.000-05:00

Bill didn't have vaginal intercourse with Monica. So what? Do you think her parents are somehow relieved that their daughter's only transgression was a BJ? Please. Become a parent, Wilson, and then get back to me on that pontification you just posted.

WJC used an intern as a humidor. In the Oval. Talk about setting back workplace gender equality. He was the adult, the employer, actually. He should've set an example. He caved to his urges. Clinton's legacy was forever marred by that lack of discretion.

Three kids here--all teenagers or beyond. Their other parent and I, from different houses, avoided much of the crappola discussed in this post, or at least we think we did. How?

We didn't choose their friends. We did choose most of their activities at a young age. By the time they got to high school, they narrowed their leisure time activity to one or two of the previously-parentally-chosen activities. That, in effect, chooses their circle of friends, without having to harp on some clod in their inner circle.

Because unless your kids are superhuman, if they have one or two main interests, outside academics, they have zippo time left in their schedule by the time they're 14 or so.

And we made sure the parents in that circle talked--regularly. Openly. And sometimes, regretably, it was painful for one or more of us. But few problems brewed very long.

It made our job easier. Not easy, but less difficult.

And one activity we chose early on was not negotiable: religion. Some Sundays, I don't know how we made it to church in one piece. But we did, almost without fail.

Trouble? Yeah, we have had some difficulties. But compared to this post, we had a cakewalk. Perfect? Heck no. But manageable, and all three are good kids. Knock on wood.

Because as much as I decry that Carmel lifestyle, I know, there but for the Grace of God go I.

Attorney W.J. Clinton was very careful to say unde...

2007-05-15T20:11:00.000-05:00

Attorney W.J. Clinton was very careful to say under questioning that "he did not have sexual relations with that woman...". As an attorney yourself, AI, you should know that is a very narrowly defined legal terminology for coitus with penile penetration. All agree that such an act did not happen with Bill and Monica.

Republican spinmeisters twisted the carefully worded (parsed) statement into "did not have sex" to try to remove an elected President from power. At no time did Clinton ever say BJs were not sex. Only GOP liars fabricate such misinformation!

AI writes".. after the details of the Lewinsky aff...

2007-05-15T20:08:00.000-05:00

AI writes

".. after the details of the Lewinsky affair were made public there were a rash of incidents where very young students were caught engaging in oral sex at school."

Gary, don't you think this could be something the media hyped up at the time? Back to my comparison, wasn't there a "rash" of teenage suicides after a song called "Suicide Solution" by Ozzy Osbourne?

In both cases it was anecdotal stuff with no statistical validity, but I'm sure it sold a few magazines.

I would be curious to know which (if any) of the c...

2007-05-15T19:53:00.001-05:00

I would be curious to know which (if any) of the commenters on this thread have teenage kids.

I do (my daughter is 15, my son is 13), and I have joint custody of them so I spend plenty of time around them and their friends and acquaintances.

Of course there are some kids who are being influenced by pop-culture trash, but I don't think it's cause for such hysterics. My guess is if you examined the family lives of the kids in this Carmel story you would find where the problem lies, and I doubt seriously it's Britney Spears or Paris Hilton.

From my vantage point it's not all that much different than when we were growing up (I say we knowing only the approximate ages of a couple of you guys. I was born in 1961). There are good kids and shit kids, nice girls and slutty girls, and all points in between.

The parents and the home life are what makes the difference; for the most part kids are able to separate pop-culture crap from reality. In some ways it reminds me of the reactions to Marilyn Manson. When I was young it was Alice Cooper and Ozzy Osborn, when Wilson was young it was Elvis Presley and the Rolling Stones who "caused" all these problems with the kids.

The pop culture trash is something I'd like to see go away just as much as you guys, but I think we have to give our kids a little more credit, and in the case of kids like those in the Carmel story, assign blame where it belongs, namely to parents.

You may recall, Doug, that after the details of th...

2007-05-15T19:53:00.000-05:00

You may recall, Doug, that after the details of the Lewinsky affair were made public there were a rash of incidents where very young students were caught engaging in oral sex at school--remember, that's not sex according to Bill's definition of sex.

Urr, "peddling," not "pedaling."

2007-05-15T19:45:00.000-05:00

Urr, "peddling," not "pedaling."

I don't think it was Bill & Monica that did the us...

2007-05-15T19:43:00.000-05:00

I don't think it was Bill & Monica that did the ushering. They were just one of the features.

I don't know who to blame, really. "The media" is certainly pedaling crap. But should we blame the merchants or the consumers? In a lot of ways, it's just the free market at work.

I feel sorry for parents today, IndyErnie. The ove...

2007-05-15T19:20:00.000-05:00

I feel sorry for parents today, IndyErnie. The overwhelming influence of this negative pop culture is nearly impossible to escape. Even responsible parents with the best of intentions find their kids succumbing to the temptation to "fit in" and doing the unthinkable.

"Is this AdvanceIndiana's eulogy to Rev. Jerry Fal...

2007-05-15T19:02:00.000-05:00

"Is this AdvanceIndiana's eulogy to Rev. Jerry Falwell ?"

Only Wilson would turn this story into a slam the conservative trash-bash.

The fact that our young people have or may slide down a slippery slope is a concern.
Our young people need role models who are positive and uplifting.
This isn't a gay or straight thing it's a morals issue. Forget the Moral Majority.
America needs to join together across political party lines before morals cease to exist in this country.
It’s not funny Wilson. Those of us who are parents are concerned.
Wilson you need to get on board whether you have children or not.
Gary I for one thank you for the coverage. Your covering this story is reinforcing.
We need the mores of the media to change.

It would have actually been nice to have gone the ...

2007-05-15T18:14:00.000-05:00

It would have actually been nice to have gone the entire day without that windbag's name being mentioned on this blog. I'm not covering his death for a reason.

Is this AdvanceIndiana's eulogy to Rev. Jerry Falw...

2007-05-15T18:12:00.000-05:00

Is this AdvanceIndiana's eulogy to Rev. Jerry Falwell ?