tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post9023912635070992824..comments2020-04-11T03:30:02.282-05:00Gary R. Welshhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15185079937305083438noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-49933672212160636352007-02-28T14:23:00.000-05:002007-02-28T14:23:00.000-05:00Who said the Dem's negotiated the content of the bill? Maybe they did in order to get those 19 votes. Maybe they didn't. But a couple of simple facts remain: The Dem's made major changes to the gov's proposal. Those major changes turned it into a Dem proposal that has failed many times in the past. Those changes also turned it into a bill that Dems, especially Bauer, knew that R's would not support. Then Bauer blamed the guv for not securing votes on a bill that Bauer had recrafted. <BR/><BR/>Again, it is actually amazing that Bosma and 18 other R's voted in favor of this big government, Democrat proposal. It is also amazing that so many Dems voted against it. <BR/><BR/>And another thing: The only way that Bauer can legitimately blame the gov is if the gov failed to secure 51 votes on his own bill. What was put up for a vote this week was NOT the gov's bill. It was the Dem's bill. And Bauer killed it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-50827063006366782762007-02-28T13:48:00.000-05:002007-02-28T13:48:00.000-05:00Other than Bosma, the entire House GOP leadership voted against the bill. There's definitely a lot of political posturing taking place on both sides. As I understand it, the GOP never agreed to put up at least 25 votes on the bill. How could the Dems negotiate the content of the bill with the GOP when there was no commitment on the part of the GOP to provide the votes needed for passage?Gary R. Welshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15185079937305083438noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-21457602444822311242007-02-28T12:49:00.000-05:002007-02-28T12:49:00.000-05:00That's right, Gary. And the D's are completely to blame. Everyone knows that if you change a bill then it is your responsibility to find enough votes to secure passage. Sometimes, of course, people change the bill so that it will not pass. The tactic for that is often the insertion of a "poison pill," but there are other ways of doing that as well.<BR/><BR/>Most amazing about this situation: The D's changed the bill to match something that they have supported but been unable to pass in the past. Then they voted against one of their own bills. <BR/><BR/>Clearly, the D's killed this bill. And I am fully convinced that the move was intentional.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-60471742427226473732007-02-28T12:37:00.000-05:002007-02-28T12:37:00.000-05:00Anon 10:42, the Senate could have amended it to look like the governor's original plan, or it could have amended it with its own plan. At that point, it would have been returned to the House for concurrence. If the House did not concur with the Senate's changes, it would be sent to conference committee. In other words, House members would have had two more opportunities to vote on the proposal. Now they will have no further opportunity.Gary R. Welshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15185079937305083438noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-11497867486452564902007-02-28T12:14:00.000-05:002007-02-28T12:14:00.000-05:00From Anon 10:42 - AI - I am not sure how the senate works with a bill once it gets passed by the house and what kind of changes they can make to it. <BR/><BR/>Could the senate change it so it looks what whatthe Gov. first proposed ? If so that would be totaly different than what came out of the house. If that would be the case how is a compromise worked out ?<BR/><BR/>To me it is a case of the Gov. came up with a plan - the Democrats said well we like that as a start but here is our idea - and then could not get all of the house democrats to even vote for it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-76839920895878435742007-02-28T11:58:00.000-05:002007-02-28T11:58:00.000-05:00Oh, c'mon Gary. Let's put this in terms that you might understand: <BR/><BR/>Pretend for a second that party control of the House and guv's office were reversed and that Porter's "hate crimes" bill had been offered by the the Democrat governor. Then imagine that some of your favorite "wing-nuts" amended the bill to be a "hate crimes" bill to protect those who are critical of homosexuals rather than those who attack homosexuals. <BR/><BR/>Would it have been the responsibility of D's in that case to keep the bill alive? Imagine Bosma standing up in that case and railing against the Democrat governor for not securing enough votes for passage. <BR/><BR/>That is precisely what happened here. Given the dramatic changes that have been made to this bill, it is amazing that it got as many Republican votes as it did. It is also amazing that so few Democrats supported the bill given that it was transformed into a bill that they have supposedly wanted for years. <BR/><BR/>The D's killed this bill. Pure and simple.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-34969753348961479572007-02-28T11:38:00.000-05:002007-02-28T11:38:00.000-05:00anon 10:42, I take it you think the Senate Republicans couldn't be trusted by the House Republicans to correct any misgivings they had about the bill as drafted so they just decided they would rather kill the whole idea for this year?Gary R. Welshhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15185079937305083438noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-67377900094252508832007-02-28T11:18:00.000-05:002007-02-28T11:18:00.000-05:00Anon 10:42 is right. But there is more. <BR/><BR/>The House D's, among other things, also changed the bill from helping poor familes access private health coverage to instead creating a new government run health system. In doing so, they created a bill that they knew would be offensive to R's. It is also dramatically different from the bill that the governor proposed. So at that point, once it became clearly the D's bill - and not one crafted by either the R's or the gov - then it became the D's responsibility to find the votes to pass it. <BR/><BR/>Great politics by Bauer. The Star and other media outlets are falling right in line. No surpise there. But it is amazing to me that Gary and others would take such a shallow view.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-90303798523403022982007-02-28T11:17:00.000-05:002007-02-28T11:17:00.000-05:00Anon 10:42 is right. But there is more. <BR/><BR/>The House D's, among other things, also changed the bill from helping poor familes access private health coverage to instead creating a new government run health system. In doing so, they created a bill that they knew would be offensive to R's. It is also dramatically different from the bill that the governor proposed. So at that point, once it became clearly the D's bill - and not one crafted by either the R's or the gov - then it became the D's responsibility to find the votes to pass it. <BR/><BR/>Great politics by Bauer. The Star and other media outlets are falling right in line. No surpise there. But it is amazing to me that Gary and others would take such a shallow view.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-29247830495370253062007-02-28T05:22:00.000-05:002007-02-28T05:22:00.000-05:00Interesting spin, 10:42. Unlikely, but interesting.<BR/><BR/>I wouldn't put too much stock in this vote. Another, or two, will follow. There is clear legislative momentum behind this concept.<BR/><BR/>As for the the Republicans you mentioned:<BR/><BR/>Turner is a certifiable loon. Espich hasn't had a decent idea since he lost his comb in 1976.<BR/><BR/>And they both know they'll be around when Mitch is gone.<BR/><BR/>Ain't God good to Indiana? Geeeeesh.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-12703782.post-39697746593311340982007-02-27T22:42:00.000-05:002007-02-27T22:42:00.000-05:00The GOV. may have proposed the idea - but the Democrats controlled the legislative process. The Indiana House Public Health Committee approved, on an 8-0, bipartisan vote for a 54.5 cents a pack increase.<BR/><BR/>Then the Democrats got pissed off at the Gov. and lowered it to 25 cents increase in a narrow 12-11 vote in the House Ways and Means Committee.<BR/><BR/>Even with the 19 R votes the Democrats could not muster 32 votes to pass it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com